want to night wean don't know where to start

[Korena_O]

I have decided that I deffinetly do want to wean my 15 month old he only nurses at night, I think it's time but I don't know where to start. I've heard about trying to give him water but he doesn't like water though I've tried many times to get him use to it he just wont have it. I wanted to know if anyone else had this issue and how you did it and how long it took.

[crystal555rose]

I think you are well on your way with him only nursing at night. My 17 month old nurses 3-5 times a day. I don't have any advice, hopefully some of the more experienced moms will reply.

[Shaunsmom]

Great job on nursing your LO for this long:) I am sorry that I don't have any advice for you but just wanted to stop in and say that you have done a great job for nursing:)

[Jacksmommy]

I never night weaned. I just let my son wean himself over time, but I read this, and if I were ever going to intentionally nightwean, this method sounds promising to me and not too harsh. I don't know how to turn this into a link, so it's long.



Changing The Sleep Pattern In The Family Bed
By Dr Jay GordonI can only imagine a mom and dad who are as tired as anyone can be, eager to see this article on sleep, and finding that we had made it unavailable for a little while!We had to do that because I didn't write the article clearly enough and need to clarify some very important facts.It would be hard to find as strong a proponent of the family bed as I am. Yet, I have received email commenting that there were sections of this "plan" which were easy to misinterpret as being just another angle on "sleep training" for young babies. It is not meant to be that. Not even close to an endorsement of the benefits of getting your baby to "soothe herself to sleep" during the first year.Here's what I really want to do: I want to offer an alternative to Ferber and Weisbluth and the Whisperer. I never want to see my ideas applied to a four month old or even a seven month old baby. As a matter of fact, I am not too excited about pushing any baby around at night but I know that sometimes it will be done and I'd like to offer a gentle, supported plan for after the first year.Before I go any further, let me express my overriding concern. Babies do better when we answer all their questions as best we can and meet their needs as best we can.
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Most of the families I have taken care of in my pediatric practice sleep in a family bed.Their babies tend to breastfeed for more than one year and they don't sleep through the night any better than most of us would if we napped and cuddled within inches of the best restaurant in town and knew it was open 24 hours a day.
This arrangement is not just adequate and tolerable, but actually feels easier to moms who can just roll over, nurse a while and fall back to sleep with their babies rather having to get out of bed to nurse or, alternatively, refuse to nurse and get their babies back to sleep some other way.Lots of parents continue this pattern through the first year and well into the second and beyond, but some get tired of it -- or just plain tired -- after a while and are looking for a way to change things. Saddest of all, some moms and dads think that total weaning from breastfeeding is the best way to get more sleep. They choose not to look into nighttime weaning as a good option instead.

There are dozens of confusing books and magazine articles implying that there can be some quick and easy way to get your baby to sleep or to not nurse through the night. I have yet to read one which told parents the complete truth: It's not easy, it's rarely quick and it's usually a little loud and heartbreaking for a few nights . . . or more. I have seen too many families needing help and getting offered choices they didn't like at all.I have a better alternative to completely weaning or to letting the baby cry it out. Babies wake up for the optimal interaction with their moms, breastfeeding back to sleep. If we offer them a little less than that for a few nights and then a little less and still less in the ensuing nights, gentle behavior modification will lead them to realize that it might not be "worth it" to knock on the door of a closed restaurant, so to speak.I don't recommend any forced sleep changes during the first year of life. Probably the only exception to this would be an emergency involving a nursing mom's health. There are many suggestions in books and magazines for pushing "sleeping through the night" during a baby's early months or during the first year. I don't think this is the best thing to do and I am quite sure that the earlier a baby gets "non-response" from parents, the more likely he is to close down at least a little.Don't get me wrong. I love the family bed, child-led weaning and cuddling all through the first, second, third year or more if it's working well and if the family is doing well. Don't let anyone convince you that this is a harmful choice or that there will be "no way" to get him out of your bed if you don't do it now. Don't believe anyone who says that babies who cuddle and nurse all night long "never" learn to self soothe or become independent. This is simply not true but it sells books and the myths stay in our culture.Some moms just don't want to do this after some months or years and there should be a third choice to the dichotomy of crying it out or giving in to all-night nursing.

Again, I support the family bed and frequent night nursing for a long time and even attempt to pull some parents along "just a little farther," but I often have to switch tacks and support and help families with difficult choices.

Here's what I recommend for older babies:Choose the most valuable seven hours of sleep for yourselves. I personally prefer 11p.m. through 6 a.m. but you might have a slightly different idea.Change the rules during those hours and be comfortable that a "well-built" family bed baby's personality can withstand this rule changing and the mild inconsistency of getting everything he wants all the time . . .oops, almost all the time. That's the word we want to show this baby. The word "almost." If only we could explain to him that "tired moms and dads take their children to the park a little less and that children of well-rested parents get to go the zoo and for hikes a lot more than children of exhausted parents." If that explanation only made sense to kids somewhere before the third birthday (and it doesn't!) they would simply roll over, say, "See you in the morning," and let us get the sleep we want.I try to do this in three- and four-night intervals.I'm assuming that you have a wonderfully healthy 12-, 15-, 20- or 30-month old baby who still loves to wake up every 2 to 4 hours to cuddle, eat or . . . whatever. I'm assuming that you have thought this through, decided you want to make changes and alerted the neighbors that it might be a little noisy for a week or so.I'm assuming that both parents agree -- or almost agree -- that this is the best thing to do. And, most important assumption of all, you are willing to go "in a straight line" to the goal of seven straight hours of sleep.The reason for that last statement: If your baby learns that crying, squirming and fussing (euphemisms, let's just say "crying" . . . sorry) for an hour will get him fed you will set yourself back quite a bit. This is the best program I have seen but it's far from easy. And now, to say it again, I really like what you've been doing. Cuddling, nursing, hugging through the night. Don't change this with my program or any other if you're happy doing what you're doing.

But . . .The First Three Nights At any time before 11 p.m. (including 10:58) nurse to sleep, cuddle and nurse when he wakes up and nurse him back to sleep, but stop offering nursing to sleep as the solution to waking after 11 p.m.. Instead…..When your baby awakens at midnight or any other time after 11 p.m., hug him, nurse him for a short time but make sure he does not fall asleep on the breast and put him down awake. Rub and pat and cuddle a little until he falls asleep but don't put him back on the breast (or give him a bottle if that's what you've been doing). He must fall asleep with your comfort beside him, but not having to nurse to feel comforted enough to drift off.Now, he will tell you that he is angry and intensely dislikes this new routine. I believe him. He will also try to tell you that he's scared. I believe he's angry, but a baby who's had hundreds of nights in a row of cuddling is not scared of falling asleep with your hand on his back and your voice in his ear. Angry, yes. Scared, no, not really.During these first three nights, repeat this pattern only after he has slept. He might sleep for fifteen minutes or he might sleep for four hours, but he has to go to sleep and reawaken to get cuddled and fed again.These will be hard nights.You may have decided you're really not ready to do this. That's OK. Stop and start over again in a few months if you like. Choosing the right time is crucial and many people choose a time suggested or pushed by friends, doctors or in-laws. This doesn't work as well.Is it better to do this in the family bed, a crib in the same room or using a crib in another room? I prefer to continue the family bed even though it might seem harder at first, but it has always seemed harder to me to be putting a baby in and out of a crib. However, a crib or toddler bed in your room may be what works best for you. Another option is to expand your bed's limits by placing another mattress against your mattress. A bit more space for each family member may help to solve some of the sleep issues. My least favorite choice is a crib or bed in a separate bedroom.Again, during these first three nights, between 11 p.m. and 6 a.m., cuddle and feed short, put him down awake, rub, pat, talk until he falls asleep and repeat this cycle only after he's slept and reawakened. At 6:01 a.m., do whatever you have been doing as a morning routine ignoring the previous seven hours' patterns. Many babies will roll over, nurse and cuddle back to sleep and give you an extra hour or so. Some won't.For me, one of the most reassuring parts of this "sleep plan" is seeing that babies wake up fine, happy and grudge-free about the change in the rules. You'll see what I mean, even if the first few minutes of the morning are not exactly as they've always been.

The Second Three NightsAgain, the nursing to sleep stops at 11 p.m. When he wakes up, hug him and cuddle him for a few minutes, but do not feed him, put him down awake. Putting him down awake is a crucial part of this whole endeavor because it really does teach him to fall asleep with a little less contact and then a little less. Not feeding is the big change during these three nights. One-year-old babies can easily go for those seven hours (or more) with no calories. They like to get fed a little through the night, but physiologically and nutritionally, this is not a long time to go without food.If I could wake my wife a few times each night, ask her to squeeze me a little fresh orange juice (my favorite drink) and rub my back while I drank it, I wouldn't choose to voluntarily give up this routine. My wife might have some different ideas and get tired of the pattern quickly. Babies rarely give up their favorite patterns and things -- day or night-- without balking and crying.I really don't like listening to babies cry. I actually hate listening to babies cry. Unlike them, though, we adults can truly understand the implications of lack of sleep for a family of three, four or more people. Sleep patterns sometimes have to be changed. The incredible safety and reassurance the family bed has provided, and continues to provide, supplies the best context and location for these changes.During these second three nights, some babies will cry and protest for ten minutes at a time and some will go for an hour or more. Your toddler is aware that you are right beside him, offering comfort and soothing. It just isn't the mode of comfort he wants at the moment. It is hard to listen to him fuss, but it will work. I believe that a well-loved baby, after a year or more in the family bed, will be the ultimate beneficiary of his parents getting more sleep. Not coincidentally, the parents benefit "big time," too."Yes, for the past many months we have enjoyed voting "1 to 2" -- non-democratically -- in favor of . . . the baby. 'Anyone want to get up all night, feed and walk the baby and be really tired all day and the next day too?' Well, the vote is 1 to 2 in favor of the baby."Now, what we're saying is, we will sometimes be voting two to one in favor of the baby's family. This "baby's family" concept may be abhorrent to he who considers himself the King of England, or Emperor of the Whole World, but our knowing he has that feeling of power allows us to confidently demote the dictator to a majority-respecting member of the family. His family.By the end of the sixth night, your baby is going back to sleep without being nursed or fed. He's going back to sleep after a nice hug, a cuddle and with your hand on his back and your words in his ear.If, at any point this is feeling "wrong" to you, stop, wait some months and start over. Don't go against your "gut instincts" which tell you that this is the wrong time to get longer sleep intervals from your baby. Your instincts are better than any sleep-modification program ever written.

The Next Four NightsNights seven, eight, nine and ten. Don't pick him up, don't hug him. When he awakens after 11 p.m., talk to him, touch him, talk some more, but don't pick him up. Rub and pat only. No feeding either, obviously. He will fall back to sleep. Repeat the rubbing and talking when he reawakens. By the end of the ninth night, he will be falling back to sleep, albeit reluctantly for some babies and toddlers, with only a rub and a soothing voice.

After these first ten nights, continue to cuddle and feed to sleep if you like and he wants to, but do nothing when he wakes up except to touch a little and talk to him briefly. This may continue for another three or four nights but occasionally keeps going for another week or more. Then . . . it stops. He has learned that he is just as well-loved, gets virtually everything he needs and wants all day, but must give seven hours per night back to his parents and family.What happens if you travel, he gets sick or some other circumstance demands a return to more nighttime interaction? Nothing. You do what you need to do (cuddle, nurse, walk, in the middle of the night, as many times as you need to) and then spend a night or two or three getting back to the new pattern the family has established.By the way, pay the baby. Make sure that he really does get a lot of the benefit of your getting a good night's sleep. Go to the park more often. Do all those things with him you said you'd do if he ever let you sleep longer. Explain it to him as you're doing it. He'll understand in an ever increasing way and will be OK with all this.

[Korena_O]

Wow thank you so much this sounds perfect for me.

[KerryS]

I was just going to post a link to that article that Jacksmommy posted - that's what we used when I night-weaned my second child.

However, the entire article probably shouldn't be cut and pasted - it's better if you just post the link, for copyright reasons.

[Jacksmommy]

Kerry, if you want to post a link, I'll delete the article.

[GirlsMama]

I night weaned my second daughter at 18 months by holding her in a different chair than where we normally nursed. I would rock her back to sleep instead of nursing her back to sleep.

My little one now is 23 months and I didn't night wean her, she just stopped nursing during the night on her own. She sucks two fingers though so she isn't a big nurser anyway.

[sunnycaligirl]

I also am having a hard time weaning my 18 month old. He just can't get to sleep without the breast! I tried everything! But that article was great. I will try that. We are having a hard time also during the day since he has wanted to nurse more because of teething. IF anyone has any other suggestions- I need them!

[Jacksmommy]

I also am having a hard time weaning my 18 month old. He just can't get to sleep without the breast! I tried everything! But that article was great. I will try that. We are having a hard time also during the day since he has wanted to nurse more because of teething. IF anyone has any other suggestions- I need them!


My suggestion for day weaning a teething 18 month old is don't if you don't have to. It will be so much easier if you wait til he's 2 and those teeth have come in. Otherwise I suggest Hyland's teething tablets and lots of good teething toys and distractions. Good luck to you =)

[sunnycaligirl]

Thanks for the advice! I just hate getting the ridicule from fam and friends that he is not weaned by now. BTW, I love the Hyland's teething tablets. That has calmed down now, but I need to night wean to get better sleep for me. (and I can't let him cry it out) Any tips that you did?

[Korena_O]

I am actually on day two of my second attempt at night weaning I read a lot of different ways of doing it but none of them really seemed to fit with how I wanted to do things. And miracle of all miracles I started by giving him a bottle of cows milk about 6 and a half ounces instead of the breast and my son slept through the night twice. I'm on cloud nine at this point. I gave him the breast at 6 when my husband goes to work in the morning and then he sleeps untill 8. Tonight or tomorrow night will be my attempt at cutting that one out so fingers crossed it goes just as well. However I will say in my case my son is already weaned from days he took that really easily. I just replace the feeding before his nap with a bottle of milk. Hope you find something that works for what you want.

[Jacksmommy]

Thanks for the advice! I just hate getting the ridicule from fam and friends that he is not weaned by now. BTW, I love the Hyland's teething tablets. That has calmed down now, but I need to night wean to get better sleep for me. (and I can't let him cry it out) Any tips that you did?


I didn't. I co-slept (which made the night nursing and the need to be close to me easier because I didn't have to get out of bed all the time), and my son nursed a lot at night until he turned 2. At 2 his needs changed and he started sleeping more deeply and not needing to nurse nearly as much. At that point he started sleeping on his own because he was okay with it. I still nursed him back to sleep if/when he woke in the night. At 3 is when he started sleeping through the night frequently.

You should know that night weaning doesn't always mean baby will sleep better at night. Some parents find that after night weaning then baby still wakes up but is harder to get back to sleep.

[Jacksmommy]

Oh, and you might tell your family and friends (not that how long you nurse is any of their business anyway) that most health organizations now recommend nursing for a minimum of 2 years. It's better for the baby and better for you.

You should wean when you and baby are ready and not let those other people push you into weaning before you want to.

[sunnycaligirl]

Jacksmommy,
Thanks...you make me feel better about the whole thing. If my son is getting enough nourishment without cow's milk, then I think I will wait til Oct. when he turns 2. I must have a strict pediatrician who says he should be weaned all the way by now. You are right! It doesn't matter what they think, as long as he is healthy right? I just thought that if he has whole milk, that he'd sleep the whole night through ('cause he wakes me up at 1am and 4am, but doesn't bother me since he sleeps next to me). Since you said he might still wake up it wouldn't be worth weaning right now.
Thank you again! I needed the encouragement. :)

[Jacksmommy]

Well I'm happy to help, and you sound like you're doing great =)
As to your pedi saying your son should be weaned by now, remember that your pedi is no expert on this. He's a medical doctor -- not a nutritionist or a child psychologist or anything else that would make his opinion on this matter any better than the person down the street. Expert opinion on the subject says that human milk is always better for human children. Really why would a cow's nutrients be better for your baby than what you provide? That just doesn't make sense. And as long as you're nursing, he's still getting that boost to his immune system.

[sunnycaligirl]

You lower my stress level every time I read your advice. You are so kind to help me out with this! My gut instinct tells me these things you say are true! So I will not worry anymore, I will just hope that he will accept the weaning when 2yr birthday comes around. (I don't want a nursing 4 yr old kid!- ha ha) You did say that their needs change, so maybe he will be willing to "grow out of it".

[Jacksmommy]

Oh, he'll definitely grow out of it. All children do. Of course the timing on that varies. Myself I prefer the "don't offer, don't refuse" method of weaning - when the time comes to start pushing that along. Don't worry. When you decide it's time for weaning to begin, you can get advice here.

[eno]

I will,too, wean my baby once he`s two. He`s 18 months old now. And yes,im having tough time during the night, as he wont let go of my breasts. But I believe breastfeeding is the best gift any mums can give to their little ones.

[eno]

Thanks for the advice! I just hate getting the ridicule from fam and friends that he is not weaned by now. BTW, I love the Hyland's teething tablets. That has calmed down now, but I need to night wean to get better sleep for me. (and I can't let him cry it out) Any tips that you did?


Despite a tremendous support from my husband for my desicion to breastfeed my babies,i do get the ridicules from his fam for nursing a big baby (my son is 18months old) .That really pissed me off, but deep down i know that they are doing this only because they are lacking of knowledge about breastfeeding issues,arent they.

[Christinasmom]

hi, i actually have the same problem with my just turned 15 month old son. But the only thing is he dosnt eat that much solids( table food) hardly at all . Im just worried that if i night weaned hes going to be pretty unhappy lil guy,.,since my pedi said he probably getting most of his calories at night with me. He only nurses to sleep for nap and bed. I have to go overnight this weekend and Im worrried , he takes a bottle only if hes distracted by a video sometimes,,but in the middle of the night he just want that boobie in his mouth ,,, Im at my wits end ,, help

[Jacksmommy]

I wouldn't worry too much about missing one or two nights of nursing. Your baby will either take in more during the day or make up for it when you return. I'm sure your dh will find a way to comfort him if he wakes during the night.
If he is nursing a lot at night and not eating solids or nursing much during the day, I wouldn't recommend nightweaning just yet. Many babies are closer to 2 or even older before they're ready for that.

[NazirsMom]

I night weaned my second daughter at 18 months by holding her in a different chair than where we normally nursed. I would rock her back to sleep instead of nursing her back to sleep.

I did the same thing for DS. I would lay him on me and rub his back and he would go back to sleep. he would never fully be wide awake so he just fell back to sleep. but when he woke up woke up, I would give him a cup of milk.