Long Term Care WWYD for your parents?

[Mommy2Ella]

Just wondering wwyd in this situation? MIL who is in her late 50s, has been self employed, and was a single mom for most of her life. She has struggled, and as far as I have seen, made very poor financial decisions. She still has a mortgage, and she has no retirement to fall back on. She and her sons today discussed the cost of long term care insurance (over 400 per month or 100 each per month). Would you allow your family to take on the $100 per month burden for her?

I said NO.

[Mommy2Ella]

Here is why...

A. she makes poor financial decisions all the time. ex going out to dinner multiple times per week buying dinner and groceries for her grown men sons. She owes a ton of money on her home, has been delinquent on payments for things, and spends spends spends.

B. She charged her son(s) 1/2 of their paychecks to live at home after college. As much as 800 per month and she charged us for daycare when we were struggling. She expects her children to support her bad choices.

C. My dh and I are planning a child next year. I have it planned out so I can take the year off of work to be at home with my two children. We have a very tight budget that includes paying off over 10k in debt and saving at least that.

[ChristmasTree]

in that case with out any steady finances, She can go to a state run nursing home. or you can take care of her yourself. But so that the state does not take her home to pay the bill have her sign it over to you before that time comes. Or don't worry about it and let the state have it.

[JudyJudyJudy]

Why won't she qualify for Social Security?

[Mommy2Ella]

Why won't she qualify for Social Security?


Being self employed, she CHOSE not to pay it. Yes that could get her in to trouble, but she only worked and contributed for 6-7 years of her life so the amt is very tiny.

[Mommy2Ella]

I guess I am saying, why should I pay for her mistakes now when we can take care of this later. She didnt plan her life well so why should we support her sudden interest in her future? Ill help out if she NEEDS it, not because she wants it.

[JudyJudyJudy]

Being self employed, she CHOSE not to pay it. Yes that could get her in to trouble, but she only worked and contributed for 6-7 years of her life so the amt is very tiny.
When self-employed, unless you're working under the table and filing NO income taxes, there is NO CHOICE not to pay into the social security system.

[Mommy2Ella]

Judy, I am not debating this. This was a detail, not the topic. As far as we all know, she pays her federal taxes, but does not pay social security.

[crystal555rose]

Sounds like she is at the mercy of whatever state subsidized care she can get.

My mom is a nurse and has taken care of many of our aging family members. Her mother lives with her sister and my mom has made it clear that she will not take care of her great aunt. She has similarly made poor decisions and is estranged from her kids.

[Mommy2Ella]

But she is asking her sons to pay for her long term care which she may or not need. Do you think it should be a burden on us now when it isnt even an issue? She is expecting everyone to be on board. I just completely disagree.

Would you help your ils out like that?

[JudyJudyJudy]

Judy, I am not debating this. This was a detail, not the topic. As far as we all know, she pays her federal taxes, but does not pay social security.
This is a detail that you are using to show how irresponsible she is. As I said, unless she is "working under the table," this detail can't be true. If this detail is wrong or incomplete, others you are giving may be as well. It sounds as though you don't have the full story.

[Mommy2Ella]

This is a detail that you are using to show how irresponsible she is. As I said, unless she is "working under the table," this detail can't be true. If this detail is wrong or incomplete, others you are giving may be as well. It sounds as though you don't have the full story.


Judy, she says she pays her taxes, but she DOES NOT pay her social security. :deadhorse: I will remove the detail to make you feel better.

[Justicedog]

This is a detail that you are using to show how irresponsible she is. As I said, unless she is "working under the table," this detail can't be true. If this detail is wrong or incomplete, others you are giving may be as well. It sounds as though you don't have the full story.


I agree here.

Is there a particular reason she's wanting long term care insurance? Does she feel the responsiblity to not have the state pay for her NH care, so she wants to buy insurance to prevent that? It doesn't sound like she has assets to protect. Is there a reason she'd not qualify for medical assistance for long term care?

But the answer to the question I think seems pretty rhetorical, is that I don't think that a child is responsible for a parent's long term care insurance. I think morally that a child should be responsible, to whatever degree is practical, for a parent's long term care. (i.e. Bill Gate's should pay for his parent's NH Care) I don't think it practical for the average Joe to pay for NH care, but I think that the average Joe should help out with paying for the things that the NH patient may need - shampoo, hygene products, etc. but cannot afford.

[JudyJudyJudy]

A few more thoughts:

A. she makes poor financial decisions all the time. ex going out to dinner multiple times per week buying dinner and groceries for her grown men sons. She owes a ton of money on her home, has been delinquent on payments for things, and spends spends spends.
It sounds as though her grown sons might owe her something. If they're not willing to help her, then they need to quit taking from her.

B. She charged her son(s) 1/2 of their paychecks to live at home after college. As much as 800 per month
I don't see the problem with expecting grown men to pay their fair share to live in a home.

and she charged us for daycare when we were struggling. She expects her children to support her bad choices.
It sounds as though she needed the money, too. Was she providing care to you for less than you would have paid elsewhere?

C. My dh and I are planning a child next year. I have it planned out so I can take the year off of work to be at home with my two children. We have a very tight budget that includes paying off over 10k in debt and saving at least that.
You don't need to be paying for her long-term care insurance. However, if your husband is one of the ones for whom she is buying dinner and groceries, he should stop accepting those things.

Also, I agree with JD that I don't understand why she thinks she needs this long-term care insurance. Does she think it will keep her out of a nursing home?

As for the whole "she made bad choices; let her go down" mentality, I don't like it. I certainly am not saying that you should pay her way, but it breaks my heart to think that people who make bad choices should starve to death or whatever later because of them. None of us is perfect; since (based on what you posted earlier on another thread) you didn't make the best choices yourself not that long ago yourself, you should understand that.

[StillSingingMom]

I'd probably skip it for different reasons than yours.

For one, there is a huge potential problem with coordinating everyone's contribution. If one contributor can't make it one month, what happens to the policy? Only you can evaluate the odds of everyone being able to do this in a reasonable and timely way.

Also, if you feel like $100 per month is not in your budget, then it's not in your budget. That is an issue that is unrelated to whether you approve of how your MIL spends her money or arranges her own budget.

However, you might consider what will happen if your MIL is disabled. Can you live with her and care for her? Will someone else be able to help with that? If there is a workable plan, then that's fine. In the end, your MIL is responsible for evaluating her own risk level and making choices that work for her.

My grandma, in a slightly similar case, has a med that is not covered by her prescription drug benefit, and her kids take turns paying for it each month. Taking turns seems to work for my mom and her sibs.

[Mommy2Ella]

I dont know why she thinks she needs it. She has a few medicals issues, but nothing that is disabling her or will in the near future.

Judy-I refuse to go out to dinner with the family, unless it is a special occasion, like a birthday and I have offered to pay. I often suggest we just have a cook out or dinner in. She takes someone out at least 2 times per week.

I think you are just trying to pick apart everything you are reading. I was pissed last night after my husband brought these ideas to me. I never said I wish her to starve etc. I just said, I dont understand how she just expects that everyone will pay 100 a month for her insurance. I said I WOULD take care of her if it is needed, but I cannot imagine paying for insurance.

[Mommy2Ella]

I'd probably skip it for different reasons than yours.

For one, there is a huge potential problem with coordinating everyone's contribution. If one contributor can't make it one month, what happens to the policy? Only you can evaluate the odds of everyone being able to do this in a reasonable and timely way.
.

ITA with this. I can see others not being able to pay or just not paying. I guess it would default and we would lose the coverage.

[hedixo01]

I understand where you're coming from. My MIL is very frustrating; spending money on palm pilots she doesn't use, computer gadgets she can't work, and other crap I find a complete waste of money. Especially when she doesn't have the money to spare. Now my DH and I haven't had to share the burden yet, but we have talked about letting our parents live with us one day when it comes to that. I for one would not help her out at the moment, but only because we can barely afford our insurance let alone anyone else. Eventhough she aggravates me if we had the means I'd help because that's what you do.


However, if you can't afford to help her financially it might be a good idea to try to help her budget better and work on paying off her debt and saving for the future. I think at the moment that would be a better solution because if you start paying for her insurance now she may never learn to live within her means.

[pawprint]

Is there any chance you'll get stuck taking care of her? If so, I'd rather pay the 100 a month.