Julie: Grandma
Julie has 3 kids (26, 22, 18) and 1 grandson (2 months old - my first!)
Kathleen has 1 child (the above mentioned 2 month old); also has epilepsy and CMT (a muscular dystrophy)
We welcome any help or answers y'all have!
I am sooooooo proud of you all! That's wonderful news and has made my day. Seriously, I just did the happy dance for you. I hope you are finally able to sit back and breathe sighs of relief knowing how well you have all done. Pat yourselves on the back and give each other great big hugs for me. How lucky you are to have each other and what a testament to how important support from family is during hard times like these. And kiss that baby boy for me and thank him for all the hard work he's done, as well. He knows mommy has the good stuff and loves him ever so much.
Hi Liane, just want to let you know how things are going. I've only used the SNS a few times, I've found it to be more of a hindrance than a help. I seem to be getting about 5-6 ounces a day, 4 on a not so great one. I'm not doing the night pumping, if I could I would but I just find it too hard to do. I have managed to get him back on my breast a couple of times though. The other day, I breastfed him 3 times, yesterday he just wouldn't take my breast at all but this morning I breastfed him again. He was on for quite a while & it seemed like he was falling asleep so I tried to take him off but when I did, he started crying. How long should I keep him on for? Because I'm not really sure if he's even on right anymore (and frankly, I don't care right now). When I'm pumping, I have to really massage my breasts to get the milk to come out so I don't know if when he's on if he's getting my milk to come out or if he just likes the sucking feeling.
Hey! Sorry it took me so long to get back to you guys. I've been having an extra busy life lately.
I'm so glad you've been able to nurse more and that you're still hanging in there. ANY of your milk he gets is certainly worth the effort for him. So, remember that when you get discouraged. I know pumping is no fun.
As far as your question about how long you should nurse him when he does nurse -- I'd say as long as he stays there, since his nursing is serendipitious at this point. Whether he's nursing for sustenance or for the comfort and satisfaction of his sucking urge, it's not hurting anything. He may just be becoming aware of his preferences and is beginning to prefer mommy over a bottle. If he seems to fall asleep, try the breast compressions to spur him on. Also, if you take him off and he cries, switch him to the other side. To me, it's great that he didn't want to stop! Whoo-hoo! You've come a long way, baby!
So, sit back, relax and look down at him and marvel at how much he's grown and remind yourself that in no time he's gonna be mobile and it may be hard for you to get him to settle down for some snuggle time for even a minute.
About the SNS -- When you have time, tell me about your experiences with it. I'm still learning, too, and would like to know specifically how it was more of a hindrance than a help to you. Let me know which brand you used, as well, and whether you were able to access the videos I suggested as well as any other learning tools you used.
Question: I understand about the nighttime thing, given your health concerns. During the day, are you offering to nurse him when he gets fussy, before you give a bottle. If not, try this now. Don't wait for him to get too hungry because he won't be patient enough with nursing at that point. But, if you offer to nurse at the earliest signs that he's getting hungry, you might be surprised at how much he might nurse. What do you think about that? Let me know . . .
I'm proud to have you as a friend and will be thinking about you and sending good vibes your way.
Glad to hear things are improving, gals! Keep us posted! The more you understand about how things work, the better you'll do so read, read, read and nurse, nurse, nurse. Before long, he'll be running around and you'll be wishing back for the time he was just a little 3 month old nursey baby.
About the nighttime thing - it is confusing for your body to have the frequent stimulation during the day and go for that long period at night without. It's kinda like giving it mixed messages. However, it's amazing to me how the body and supply will adjust to just about any schedule. Have you tried waking your baby up and nursing at night? Sometimes a baby who is either sleepy because he's ready to go to sleep or he's been awakened can sometimes be coaxed into nursing when they won't nurse at any other time. Try putting him in the bed while he's sleeping and all is quiet and relatively dark, stroke his back and head and just make your breast available to him, maybe brushing your nipple against his lips and cheek. He may just take it and nurse for a while. It may also help to strip him down to his diaper and you with no top. He may find the warm, snuggly environment very appealing. It's in him and you to be drawn together this way. Also, try taking a bath with him with lights dimmed and maybe some soft music. He just has to be reminded of what it is that's in it for him. This is what you can do for him that no one else can. Also, if he's using a pacifier, read up on that as well. It's proven that some babies waste their sucking urge on the pacifier and when it's out of the picture, they will seek another way to satisfy that urge, like hopefully nursing from mom.
Talk to you later. Keep on thinking positive and read, read, read all you can from both the website I sent you and www.llli.org .
Good to hear from you. Tell me about the SNS you've gotten. Are you trying to nurse with a nipple shield and the SNS or is the nipple shield part of the SNS? Were you able to watch the videos on www.thebirthden.com/newman ? Also, using the breast compression technique should be helpful when nursing or pumping. I'm so proud of you for hanging in there. I wish you were experiencing more joy from nursing than you are. It's my hope that you can still acquire more of that.
Tell me about the SNS and hit that website. There's so much good info I could never convey to you in this forum. I'll be thinking about you . . .
And I read something online that said the Lact-Aid was better & more effective than the Medela SNS. In your opinion, which do you think would hold up better? And how often do you think I would have to use it?
I just happened to be looking closely at the Medela SNS today. I have a mom I'm meeting with in the a.m. who's baby is 1 month old and she hasn't nursed since she left the hospital. I'm sure either is good. The Medela probably holds up better and looks like it would be easier to clean. But hopefully, we're not talking long-term use. Medela has a more helpful and user friendly website. Bottom line, I'd probably go with whichever is the least expensive and most accessible.
How often do I think you should use it? Well, ideally, you would stop all bottles or artificial nipples and begin nursing for all feedings using the supplementer to deliver the formula. Without a bottle of pacifier, he will have a strong urge to suck and should quickly figure out he can satisfy that by nursing, plus he gets his tummy full. You could still pump if you want, it wouldn't hurt, but you don't have to pump at all. How do you feel about that?
Did the LC give you a reason why the SNS wouldn't work? My experience is that even if a woman's milk never comes in (which is virutally impossible if she's nursing -- for every suck that much milk is made) time spent at the breast is most beneficial to both mother and baby. You can get different gauge tubes for the SNS so that if it's thought that nursing is "too much work" for the baby, then a bigger gauge tube can be used. Either brand SNS is good, the Lact-Aid can be worn as a necklace, but it probably harder to clean. The Medela is good, instead of a pouch, it has a bottle.
About pumping, yes, to bring on a full supply, you need to pump at least 8 times a day. But Kathleen, you have the baby there. If you pump 8 times a day, and then feed the baby each time it's hungry, you're not gonna have time for much else, I'm afraid. With the SNS you can just get right into the breastfeeding mode, pretty soon, you'll have milk and soon after that starts, you can back off the SNS.
I'm not sure if I already gave you this link www.thebirthden.com/newman but there's good info on there. There's even a short video about the SNS.
If you want to do this, I'm here for you. You've had a rough start, but you can do this. It's basicaly gonna take some devotion to spending time with the baby to the breast to make up for lost time. Once you get your foundation supply laid, that will taper off. It's not like you have to go dig a ditch, but it may take more patience than digging a ditch requires.
Wanna make a go for it?
juliekathleen2 wrote:
Hi Liane, thanks for getting back so quickly. I'm currently renting a pump from my hospital & trying to pump 8 times a day like they want me to but I think it's going to be impossible! I just got the pump on Saturday but wasn't able to really use it over the weekend so I'm on my 8 times today. The lactation consultant I was dealing with mentioned the supplemental nursing system before & when I last spoke with her a few days ago I asked her about it but she said it wouldn't work and that I should just get the pump & do it 8 times a day for two weeks and then we'll see where my supply is from there. How many times a day do you think I should pump? And do you know which supplemental nursing systems are available? I've looked online a little bit & I think there's only Medela and Lact-Aid.
Hey Kathleen! Good to hear from you. I am sorry your medical professionals were not more supportive of your efforts to nurse. At his age, you can still nurse, but it will take some extra effort and patience on both your parts. First, are you pumping now? Or, is he basically getting total formula? Either way, I suggest you get a device called a nursing supplementer. It's basically a little pouch which you put either breast milk (bm) or formula in and hang around your neck like a necklace. There's a little hollow tube that comes from it and you tape it to the side of your breast and the end sits alongside your nipple. You put the baby to the breast, he sucks, and although there may be no milk coming from you, he will be rewarded with not only you warm skin, but also the fluid from the bag. Meanwhile, you are getting stimulated to produce milk and soon you will be able to remove the device. In your circumstance, it would be a good idea to pump in between times to begin with, just because the more stimulation you get, the sooner your milk will come in and the more there will be. You said your Drs. didn't have a pump for you. Are you on WIC or might you qualify? They can provide you with both the supplementer and the pump at no charge if you're a client. They might have to make a phone call or two to locate the supplementer, but the federal government provides these and the program is generous. I can help you with that, if you need me to. When you put him to nurse, he may be confused at first, and not be sure what it is you want him to do. You will just have to talk sweetly to him, exress some milk from the tube to let him know it's there and maybe sing to him and smile. Encourage him and soon he'll figure it out. Breathe deeply and project your warm, calm, loving energy and he'll pick up on that. Don't let yourself be tense or show frustration at this time. He may take it personally, so to speak. All his food should be delivered this way, once you get going. In the meantime, offer for him to nurse often. Just a few sucks is better than none. If he takes a pacifier, don't waste that sucking urge on it, use it to your advantage. Strip down both of you at times and have lots of skin-to-skin, say while you're watching movies in bed or taking a bath together. Any time you can get him to nurse at all is progress. He may decide he likes it quite a bit and make your goal a lot easier. After all, he was born to do this and has just learned to route the urge in other directions. Avoid giving him bottles himself, if at all possible. He should get the message that all he gets from you is nursing. This will help reduce his confusion, as well. Well, I've offered a lot of info here and don't want to overwhelm you. I have some links to share if you are interested and will discuss with you further, after some feedback on this. Your attitude and desire are key to making this happen. You can certainly do it -- women adopt babies and nurse them, even if they've never been pregnant. So, you just have a little re-awakening to do. I'll help, if you want. Until later .... Happy Nursing!
Hey guys! Sorry we're having so much trouble getting together. I'm still looking for you. I will check for messages several times a day over the weekend, so let me know if/when you want to meet to talk. I hope things are going well. Remember, there's usually a pretty easy fix to most nursing problems. Even is a woman has taken a few days' break to get some perspective, she can still resume nursing. So, don't give up! I'll bet we can fix whatever problem there is.
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